Posts by Reefton Jack

10

Doing Good Humane things for Other People- Why Jw's Won't Notice It

by flipper in

jw
friends

one thing that always bothered me when i was a witness, was that the main thing you were admired for was how much time you got in the service each month, how many times you commented at meetings, whether you hung out with " spiritual " people, and your approval was based on how you were advancing in the faith based on your position, regular or auxilarry pioneer, ministerial servant or elder.

if you weren't any of those things, even if you did good to or for others, it was not noticed.

if joe publisher sitting in the corner went and mowed sister old ladies yard in 100 degree heat out of love it was not emphasized, because it didn't really fit in with the agenda the elders or governing body deems important as being for the advancement of kingdom interests.

Reefton Jack

It largely comes down to a case of you tend to get what you are always harping on about:
- If you are forever bashing the R&F up about that column on the Monthly Report form entitled "HOURS",
- If you are forever making everyone feel guilty that they are not doing "enough"
(As I am sure happened to all of us)
- Then, not surprisingly, the "HOURS" column is all that anyone will be interested in.

While with the JWs, I could never figure out those that reckoned that they were drawn to "the truth" by nothing other than the love they saw in the congregations.
(Believe it or not, I did know some individuals who claimed that)

- I thought at the time that there must have been a point somewhere that I had missed!

26

Anyone recall the WTS's crazy notions about the literal "heart"?

by fahrvegnugen in

back in my dub days, i used to make copies of all the old recorded talks i could get my hands on.

in the process i was surprised to come across several talks in which the "faithful slave" tried to make the case that all the scriptures talking about the "heart" were not figurative, but referred to one's literal heart--the organ itself!

as i recall, they even incorporated some pseudo-scientific quotes as "proof" that the heart could effect your thoughts and motivations.

Reefton Jack

That District Assembly in 1971 ("Divine Name", I seem to remember being its title) was the first one that I ever attended.

So, yes - I well remember all that nonsense about the literal heart being the generator of ones emotions.
To an impressionable sixteen year old, what they seemed to be saying was that the heart muscle has a mind of its own!:
- That was certainly the idea that I got, after coming away from that assembly, anyway.

And also, I recall a lot being said about that nerve that interconnects the brain to the heart.
(Although that may have been said following the "Divine Name" assembly)

However, what I remember even more vividly was a few years afterward, when I got all tangled up trying to explain this pseudo-science to somebody else!
In retrospect, no bloody wonder!

Jack.

24

Did You See Brothers Use Politics to Reach Out For M/S or Elder Positions?

by flipper in

jw
friends

hello folks.

valid question i believe.

in the early 80's 1979 to 1985 i was a m/s and stepped down after having 3 kids bang, bang, bang in late 20's.

Reefton Jack

You definitely have to be part of the congregation's Inner Clique before you can expect any chance of being appointed.
Being a "pioneer" gives you almost guaranteed entry to that clique, as does being the son or son-in-law of an elder.
Without either of those advantages, though, entry is strictly limited by who you know.

The first time I was appointed an MS, it was without even trying:
- I was a Regular Pioneer, and thus very much in the good books of the Body of Elders.

The second time around took a bloody long time to come about:
- as groveling to others never came easily to me!

Jack.

46

You Need To Give Credit To The Society For Your Education

by The wanderer in

jw
friends

you need to give credit to the society for your education.the watchtower and awake magazines have been helping individuals receive a g.e.d .

or high school diploma.

where did you learn the art of public speaking?

Reefton Jack

The education given by the Watchtower Society DOES qualify a person for a degree:

- A Bachelor of Stupidity!

47

Former Jehovahs WitnessAre Hypocrites

by The wanderer in

jw
friends

former jehovahs witnessare hypocritesit amazes me how these people who once donned three-piece suits .

with book, bag and bible in hand are now singing the blues.

these former jehovahs witnesses, who would annoy a man and his.

Reefton Jack

Whenever I hear the accusation "Hypocrite" waved around, I automatically also hear warning bells sounded. In my experience, the ones always making the loudest use of that term have also proven to be the worst offenders: - In other words, it tells you more about the accuser than those being accused. (Like it takes one to be able to recognise one!) Jack. PS: I have never in my life worn a three piece suit, either!

35

Where do you go for your spiritual needs?

by Blindbutnowisee in

jw
friends

i never was baptize as a jw.

i use to study with them for years, i even went as for as becoming a unbaptize publisher.

i gave up being a publisher because i did not feel genuine in my efforts to preach.

Reefton Jack

Interesting to hear of others feelings on this matter.
I find myself in full agreement with those who have no "Spiritual Need"
- and who consequently do not need to go to anywhere to have this need met!

The WTS's line is that all people have this inbuilt "need" for spirituality:
- and that they (and ONLY they) are capable of satisfying it.

During the 14 years since I broke with the JWs, I have always tried to keep an open mind on this - and other such matters.

However, I have yet to experience anything of this "Spiritual Need" that they kept telling me I have!

Jack

7

Religion Makes Good Men Evil?

by zack in

i watched chris hitchens last night on a show with tim russert.

while i disagree strongly with most of what hitchens says, he did say.

one thing that struck me as profound.

Reefton Jack

Blondie raises an interesting question:
- Does Religion make Good Men (or Women) Evil, or does it attract people who were Evil in the first place?

i.e. Does it hold a particular attraction for that small minority of the population that is classified as
"Sociopathic"?
( According to the American Psychiatric Association's "Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders" 1987, Anti-Social Personality Disorder affects approximately 3 per cent of the population ).

This could well be the case - religion may form a special attraction to some who have sociopathic tendencies.
However, the scale of involvement in acts of religiously-inspired (or politically inspired) cruetly would tend to suggest that something else is at work here, as well :
- More than a 3 percent minority can be induced to participate in cruel, even brutal, activities.
- Providing that these acts of cruelty have the "Sanction" of The Group.
( Whether that Group be a religious one or a political one).

7

Religion Makes Good Men Evil?

by zack in

i watched chris hitchens last night on a show with tim russert.

while i disagree strongly with most of what hitchens says, he did say.

one thing that struck me as profound.

Reefton Jack

When I was "coming into the Truth", and saw it as my God-given duty to convert anyone who would listen, my father tried to warn me that there are two things best not talked about:
- Religion and Politics.

He may well have had a point!
Hitchens is quite correct in his observations:
- Using religion as their justification, otherwise decent people are capable of carrying out cruelty;
even extreme cruelty.

Before, though, we try and isolate isolate religion in the "Sin Bin", the same would have to be said of politics:
- it, too, is capable of inspiring otherwise decent people into carrying out acts of brutality.
eg. Nazi rule in Germany, Communist rule in the former USSR, and many other cases too numerous to mention.

The human creature being what we are, it is all too easy to become fanatical about either matter.
(In its more extreme forms, politics also becomes distinctly Cult-like).

Perhaps the real Bogey Man is the Cult:
- And that both religion and politics are matters that should be handled with extreme caution!
(It is difficult to imagine how religion could be "banned" - much less politics?)

Jack.

28

Did You Take Your "Ministry" Seriously?

by minimus in

jw
friends

since all jehovah's witnesses are "ministers" and are to act like "watchmen" so as to not be bloodguilty before jehovah god, would you say that you, personally were a fine zealous preacher?

did you make sure that you accurately kept your house-to-house records up to date?

did you make sure you were back in a timely fashion once you placed literature?

Reefton Jack

There was a time when I did take it seriously.

However, you can only deceive people for so long; and it got harder and harder to do.

Jack.

32

Did You Like Your Congregation?

by minimus in

jw
friends

the hall i was in the last few years was not a bad place.

most of the people were middle class, some had college educations (like the po and his wife); they generally weren't over critical.

of course there were a few elders and publishers that were pains but for the most part the people in that hall were pretty decent.

Reefton Jack

I was in a total of ten different congregations during my time with the Borg.
Most I thought were all-right; at least as "all-right" as anything connected with the WTS could be!

However, for me, there seemed to be a thin patch in the mid-1980s:
- I recall in particular the Christchurch South West Congregation.
- diamaondblue1974's post accurately describes the Elders and Ministerial Servants in that congregation, also.
- All I could add to diamondblue1974's post is that I am not sure if the "plastic"
was of the Thermoplastic (i.e. re-mouldable) or the Thermo-hardening (i.e. strictly a "Oncer") type material!

Jack.